On the TimesDaily Religion Forum, I began a discussion by asking the question, "Should We Interpret The Bible?" And, my Forum Friend, Tigrtrek replied, "Of course people should read the Bible and decide for themselves. (Does) 'Study to show thyself approved rightly dividing the word of truth' ring a bell? Don't let someone -- me, Bill, the Pope, Pat Robertson, or anyone tell you what it (the Bible) says. Read it yourself. And don't limit yourself to any one translation. I spent too many years blinded by a KJV-only bias."
Tigr, I agree with you completely that we should not limit ourselves to one specific Bible translation. Personally, my main Bible is the NASB; but, when doing an indepth study of a passage I will use the NASB, the NKJV, and sometimes the KJV. These are word for word translations and tend to be better for such studies. In my writings, I will sometimes use the NIV when it better expresses the thought I am trying to convey.
I stay away from all paraphrase Bibles, such as Peterson's "The Message." The paraphrase Bibles tend to be more just the author's interpretation and not a translation, i.e., it is closer to a commentary than a Bible translation. Another paraphrase Bible is "The Living Bible." On the title page, in the subtitle, it reads "Paraphrased, A Thought-for-Thought Translation." No, a Bible cannot be a "paraphrase" and, at the same time, be a "translation." Another paraphrase Bibles is the "Good News for Modern Man" -- also called Today's English Version.
The "New Living Translation" began as a redo of "The Living Bible" and would fall more into the category of the NIV.
In a discussion of the New Living Translation, we read at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Living_Translation :
"It has been suggested that this "thought-for-thought" methodology, while making the translation easier to understand, is less accurate than a literal (formal equivalence) method, and thus the New Living Translation may not be suitable for those wishing to undertake detailed study of the Bible."
I also stay away from the Amplified Bible for a similar reason -- the amplification tends to put it more into a commentary status. And, I tend to stay away from the "gender neutral" translations such as the TNIV. In my thinking, if God had intended the Bible to be gender neutral -- He would have authored it that way.
A very good Bible web site is the Blue Letter Bible: http://www.blueletterbible.org/index.cfm
The Blue Letter Bible web site has 12 English translations as well as Spanish, Latin Vulgate, Greek, and Hebrew. You can choose to view a verse in side by side translations for comparison -- or view a chapter in any of the available translations. The site offers Strong's Concordance for word studies, commentaries, Bible dictionary aids, and other great information to help in your Bible study.
Like you, Tigr, I am a wee bit uneasy when someone tells me that we must use only the KJV Bible. And, I agree with you that we must never allow anyone, myself included, to dictate to us what a Scripture verse or passage means, i.e., that their interpretation is the absolute and only correct interpretation.
Yet, on the other hand, I will suggest to anyone who is a new believer, who is not yet mature in Biblical knowledge -- that you find someone who is mature and can mentor you. And, get involved in a good Bible study group -- and do not miss your church's Sunday School classes. I know that, in the church I attend, our Sunday School classes have always tended to be as interactive, challenging, and exciting as our Bible studies. This is an environment where we all can grow more mature in our personal knowledge of God's Word.
I recall my own situation the first few years I was a believer. My Bible knowledge was more on the "Kindergarten" level. In early 1991, during the "Operation Desert Storm" Gulf War, when Iraq set all the oil fields on fire and the scene was looking like Armageddon -- our Bible study leader, Tom Fletcher, began to talk about the Rapture, the Tribulation, etc.
And, I had no idea what he was talking about. Of course, I was not going to ask and show my Bible ignorance -- so, I just smiled and pretended to know what he meant. And, then, I began my own quest to understand End Times eschatology.
But, my point is that we all, when we are new Christian believers, need someone more mature in the Word to mentor us. I began reading Dr. J. Vernon McGee and other Bible teachers, listening as much as possible to KWVE Christian Radio, as well as attending Bible studies and Sunday School classes. I have attended Eschatology Conferences -- and, yes, I read the full set of "Left Behind" series books by Tim LaHaye and Jerry Jenkins -- and many other good books on eschatology.
I found mentors and learned from them. Some I soon outgrew, i.e., wanted more meat in my Biblical diet -- so, I moved on to other mentors. And, today, I am still learning -- and have built quite a nice personal library.
However, with all that said -- I have never met, heard, or read a Bible teacher, scholar, or theologian with whom I agree 100% of the time. I do as the apostle Paul tells us in Acts 17:11 -- I read, listen, etc., to my teachers -- consider what they have taught me -- and then, compare it with what I find in Scripture. And, from this -- I settle on what I believe this Scripture passage is teaching me.
Doing this, I feel that I am fairly well grounded in my theology and that I stand on a pretty solid theological foundation. Could I be wrong on some things? You bet! But, I will keep studying and learning until the day I breath my last breath in this mortal body or He comes to rapture me.
And, then, my real education will begin. Can you imagine having an eternity, all that time -- to continue learning? Do you doubt this is true? Consider this point. Only God knows everything and cannot learn.
If we could ever get to a point where we know everything and there is nothing more we can learn -- we would be Gods. Since we know this will never happen (Lucifer is good proof of this) -- then, we must keep learning even after we are in the eternal presence of God. Isn't that exciting? All of these issues which we are debating today, we will know -- and much more. Yes, exciting! I can hardly wait to begin working on my Advanced Degree!
If you have found this useful, please feel free to share it with your Friends, Relatives, Associates, and Neighbors -- all your FRANs. Let's all study to grow more mature in our knowledge of God's Word -- and then use that knowledge to share the Gospel with all the world -- until He returns.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill Gray
Showing posts with label end times. Show all posts
Showing posts with label end times. Show all posts
Tuesday, October 5, 2010
Saturday, June 19, 2010
Prophecy And The Rest Of The Bible
Earlier, I wrote an article titled "When Is The Bible Literal And When Is it Symbolic?" and posted it on the TimesDaily Religion Forum. As you might expect, I have had a few responses -- from believers and from my atheist Friends. The one below seemed to be a good segue into talking about prophecy.
If you find this useful, please feel free to share it with your Friends, Relatives, Associates, and Neighbors -- all your FRANs. Let's keep sharing His Gospel with the world -- and looking forward to His imminent return.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill Gray
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hi Tigrtrek,
You tell us, "Making a determination of what's literal and what's symbolic is part of what is called rightly dividing the word of truth. When the Bible says that Jesus is the stone that the builders rejected it does not literally mean he is a rock. This is easy to pick out, but prophecy, which is largely symbolic, is more open to interpretation.
Many people dedicate their lives to studying prophecy and still don't have all the answers. I prefer to focus on the Gospels, the Epistles and the Old Testament. Whatever the future holds God will work out."
That is a good example of Biblical allegory -- Jesus the Rock. Thank you.
Like you, I enjoy the Gospels, Epistles, and the Old Testament. However, since about 30% of the Bible is prophecy -- how can we not focus on this? True, many people spend their lives studying prophecy -- but, that does not mean that we lay people should not also study it.
Often times, the Holy Spirit will give us a special insight when studying His Word. I remember, about twenty years ago, when I first began to study the End Times prophecies -- I was totally confused about who would be in the Millennial Kingdom and where would Satan, who had been locked in the abyss for one thousand years, raise his large army of non-believers to do battle against Jesus Christ and the holy city, Jerusalem.
One afternoon, as I was driving home from work, I was sitting at a traffic light. My mind was on the traffic light and getting home; not on the book of Revelation or even the Bible. Yet, all of a sudden, a thought came into my mind: When Jesus Christ returns at the end of the seven year Tribulation -- even though many, many people will have been killed by the Antichrist -- there will be many people who have survived the horrible Tribulation. This group will consist of both believers and non-believers.
These people will stand in judgment before Jesus Christ -- the Sheep and Goat Judgment found in Matthew 25:31-46 for the Gentile nations, and the Judgment of Israel found in Ezekiel 20:32-38 for the Jews. Those who are not believers will "go away into eternal punishment" (Matthew 25:46). To those who are believers, He will say, "Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you. . ." (Matthew 25:34). That kingdom is His Millennial Kingdom -- and, later, the eternal kingdom.
And, to the Jews, He will say, "'And I will bring you into the wilderness of the peoples, and there I will enter into judgment with you face to face. As I entered into judgment with your fathers in the wilderness of the land of Egypt, so I will enter into judgment with you,' declares the Lord GOD. 'I will make you pass under the rod, and I will bring you into the bond of the covenant'" (Ezekiel
20:35-37)
This will be the remnant of Israel, His chosen people, who, with the believers from the Sheep and Goat Judgment, will enter the Millennial Kingdom, God's Kingdom on earth, in their mortal bodies.
So, the inhabitants of the Millennial Kingdom, ruled by Jesus Christ from the throne of David in Jerusalem, will consist of the Raptured church and the Old Testament saints in our immortal bodies -- and the believers who survive the Tribulation, both Jew and Gentile, in their mortal bodies. Those in their mortal bodies will continue to marry and bear children.
During the Millennial Kingdom, Satan will be locked in the abyss, so his demonic temptations will not exist on earth for that one thousand years. Those who enter the Millennial Kingdom will be believers. Yet, they and those born during the Millennial Kingdom will still bear the sin curse of Adam, they will have the Adamic sin nature curse. Only death or the Rapture can remove this curse.
And, having this sin nature -- the only way to have eternal salvation is still through Jesus Christ. Keep in mind -- He is the ONLY Way to God the Father. So, the people born during the Millennial Kingdom will still have to confess Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior to be saved.
Even though the Satanic influence has been removed for one thousand years; there will still be people born during this time who will, for whatever reason, not invite Jesus Christ to be their Lord and Savior. These people will not be causing death and destruction as we have on earth today -- for Jesus Christ will be the ruler of this world. Yet, some will choose not to follow Him and will not receive His imputed righteousness.
When Satan is released from the abyss after one thousand years; these people who have not made a commitment to Jesus Christ will be easy prey for him, as he lures them into his army. This is the army which will come against Jesus Christ and the holy city at the end of the Millennial Kingdom -- and they will all be supernaturally destroyed (Revelation 20:7-10).
Now, did the Holy Spirit reveal all this to me that day as I sat at the traffic light? No. He revealed to me about the people, the Tribulation survivors, who will enter the Millennial Kingdom in their mortal bodies. This so piqued my interest that I began my study of the End Times and Revelation in earnest.
And, over the years, layer after layer has been peeled back, as the Holy Spirit revealed to me more and more knowledge of the End Times. You might say that, although I had already been studying End Times prophecy -- that traffic light revelation birthed my desire to really understand End Time prophecy.
Another example of the Holy Spirit leading as we study Scripture: For years I had tried to read the book of Job -- and could not get past chapter one. One evening I was sitting on my patio studying the book of John. A cross reference sent me to Job 42:10, "The LORD restored the fortunes of Job when he prayed for his friends, and the LORD increased all that Job had twofold."
Once again, my interest was piqued -- and I began to read Job. For whatever reason, that night reading Job was as easy as reading an interesting novel -- it just flowed. That night I read and had a fairly good understanding of the book of Job -- and have since led a Bible study on it. Who or what led me to Job 42:10 that night? The Holy Spirit, of course.
John 14:26, "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you."
Tigr, no part of the Bible is insignificant; but, most especially not God's revelations which He sends to us through His prophecies. Do not neglect 30% of His Written Word.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill
If you find this useful, please feel free to share it with your Friends, Relatives, Associates, and Neighbors -- all your FRANs. Let's keep sharing His Gospel with the world -- and looking forward to His imminent return.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill Gray
Hi Tigrtrek,
You tell us, "Making a determination of what's literal and what's symbolic is part of what is called rightly dividing the word of truth. When the Bible says that Jesus is the stone that the builders rejected it does not literally mean he is a rock. This is easy to pick out, but prophecy, which is largely symbolic, is more open to interpretation.
Many people dedicate their lives to studying prophecy and still don't have all the answers. I prefer to focus on the Gospels, the Epistles and the Old Testament. Whatever the future holds God will work out."
That is a good example of Biblical allegory -- Jesus the Rock. Thank you.
Like you, I enjoy the Gospels, Epistles, and the Old Testament. However, since about 30% of the Bible is prophecy -- how can we not focus on this? True, many people spend their lives studying prophecy -- but, that does not mean that we lay people should not also study it.
Often times, the Holy Spirit will give us a special insight when studying His Word. I remember, about twenty years ago, when I first began to study the End Times prophecies -- I was totally confused about who would be in the Millennial Kingdom and where would Satan, who had been locked in the abyss for one thousand years, raise his large army of non-believers to do battle against Jesus Christ and the holy city, Jerusalem.
One afternoon, as I was driving home from work, I was sitting at a traffic light. My mind was on the traffic light and getting home; not on the book of Revelation or even the Bible. Yet, all of a sudden, a thought came into my mind: When Jesus Christ returns at the end of the seven year Tribulation -- even though many, many people will have been killed by the Antichrist -- there will be many people who have survived the horrible Tribulation. This group will consist of both believers and non-believers.
These people will stand in judgment before Jesus Christ -- the Sheep and Goat Judgment found in Matthew 25:31-46 for the Gentile nations, and the Judgment of Israel found in Ezekiel 20:32-38 for the Jews. Those who are not believers will "go away into eternal punishment" (Matthew 25:46). To those who are believers, He will say, "Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you. . ." (Matthew 25:34). That kingdom is His Millennial Kingdom -- and, later, the eternal kingdom.
And, to the Jews, He will say, "'And I will bring you into the wilderness of the peoples, and there I will enter into judgment with you face to face. As I entered into judgment with your fathers in the wilderness of the land of Egypt, so I will enter into judgment with you,' declares the Lord GOD. 'I will make you pass under the rod, and I will bring you into the bond of the covenant'" (Ezekiel
20:35-37)
This will be the remnant of Israel, His chosen people, who, with the believers from the Sheep and Goat Judgment, will enter the Millennial Kingdom, God's Kingdom on earth, in their mortal bodies.
So, the inhabitants of the Millennial Kingdom, ruled by Jesus Christ from the throne of David in Jerusalem, will consist of the Raptured church and the Old Testament saints in our immortal bodies -- and the believers who survive the Tribulation, both Jew and Gentile, in their mortal bodies. Those in their mortal bodies will continue to marry and bear children.
During the Millennial Kingdom, Satan will be locked in the abyss, so his demonic temptations will not exist on earth for that one thousand years. Those who enter the Millennial Kingdom will be believers. Yet, they and those born during the Millennial Kingdom will still bear the sin curse of Adam, they will have the Adamic sin nature curse. Only death or the Rapture can remove this curse.
And, having this sin nature -- the only way to have eternal salvation is still through Jesus Christ. Keep in mind -- He is the ONLY Way to God the Father. So, the people born during the Millennial Kingdom will still have to confess Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior to be saved.
Even though the Satanic influence has been removed for one thousand years; there will still be people born during this time who will, for whatever reason, not invite Jesus Christ to be their Lord and Savior. These people will not be causing death and destruction as we have on earth today -- for Jesus Christ will be the ruler of this world. Yet, some will choose not to follow Him and will not receive His imputed righteousness.
When Satan is released from the abyss after one thousand years; these people who have not made a commitment to Jesus Christ will be easy prey for him, as he lures them into his army. This is the army which will come against Jesus Christ and the holy city at the end of the Millennial Kingdom -- and they will all be supernaturally destroyed (Revelation 20:7-10).
Now, did the Holy Spirit reveal all this to me that day as I sat at the traffic light? No. He revealed to me about the people, the Tribulation survivors, who will enter the Millennial Kingdom in their mortal bodies. This so piqued my interest that I began my study of the End Times and Revelation in earnest.
And, over the years, layer after layer has been peeled back, as the Holy Spirit revealed to me more and more knowledge of the End Times. You might say that, although I had already been studying End Times prophecy -- that traffic light revelation birthed my desire to really understand End Time prophecy.
Another example of the Holy Spirit leading as we study Scripture: For years I had tried to read the book of Job -- and could not get past chapter one. One evening I was sitting on my patio studying the book of John. A cross reference sent me to Job 42:10, "The LORD restored the fortunes of Job when he prayed for his friends, and the LORD increased all that Job had twofold."
Once again, my interest was piqued -- and I began to read Job. For whatever reason, that night reading Job was as easy as reading an interesting novel -- it just flowed. That night I read and had a fairly good understanding of the book of Job -- and have since led a Bible study on it. Who or what led me to Job 42:10 that night? The Holy Spirit, of course.
John 14:26, "But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you."
Tigr, no part of the Bible is insignificant; but, most especially not God's revelations which He sends to us through His prophecies. Do not neglect 30% of His Written Word.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill
When Is The Bible Literal
And When Is it Symbolic?
And When Is it Symbolic?
This is a question we often hear: When do we read the Bible literally and when as symbolism? Actually, it is not an either/or situation. Most often, we read the Bible literally. But, how do we handle it when it cannot be read literally?
My Friend, VP, is in a church which reads the entire Bible as symbolism and allegory. So, his question is meant to be a "trick question" -- a "gotcha!" But, this is a very valid question and, I am sure is often confusing to Christian believers -- and, even more so, to new Christians and to new seekers only beginning their Biblical journey.
I pray that this dialogue will be a wee bit of help to you. If so, please feel free to share it with your Friends, Relatives, Associates, and Neighbors -- all your FRANs. Let's keep sharing the Word of God and the Gospel of Jesus Christ with all we meet -- until He returns.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill Gray
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hi to my Forum Friends,
In the discussion which I began titled "An Open Letter From The Son Of Madalyn Murray O'Hair" -- my Friend, VP, tells me, "But I would really like an answer to the question -- WHO decides which parts of the 'literal' word of God is symbolic? When there is no mention of symbolism in the text. I am really trying to follow your logic. Help me understand."
Thank you, VP. That is a valid question -- and a very good question. Since we know the Bible is the Holy Spirit inspired (authored by God), inerrant (authored by God, and God does not make mistakes), literal (God says what He means, and means what He says) Written Word of God -- there must be a way to know when to read the Bible literally and when to apply symbolism and allegory to our interpretation. Yes, there is, my Friend.
When studying the Bible, first, as you begin your study, you interpret the Scripture passage or verse you are reading literally. If this fits, and, you can tell if it makes sense -- that is the proper interpretation. If not, then look at that same passage under the lens of symbolism or allegory. If symbolism is used; you will be able to find the meaning for that symbolism in other parts of the Bible. This may require some dedicated study -- but, then, you are studying God's Word to gain more knowledge from it; so, what's a wee bit more work -- when the rewards are so great?
An example: In Revelation 1:16 we read, "In His right hand He held seven stars, and out of His mouth came a sharp two-edged sword; and His face was like the sun shining in its strength."
And, this symbolism is explained in Revelation 1:20, "As for the mystery of the seven stars which you saw in My right hand, and the seven golden lampstands: the seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches."
Another example is found in Ezekiel 37:1-10 when the prophet Ezekiel is given a prophetic vision by God.
Ezekiel 37:1-3, "The hand of the LORD was upon me, and He brought me out by the Spirit of the LORD and set me down in the middle of the valley; and it was full of bones. He caused me to pass among them round about, and behold, there were very many on the surface of the valley; and lo, they were very dry. He said to me, 'Son of man, can these bones live?" And I answered, "O Lord GOD, You know.'"
And, in Ezekiel 37:11 we find, "Then He said to me, "'on of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel;. . .'"
This passage is symbolic and allegorical -- and, at the same time, it is prophetic. It is prophesying about the future return of the nation so Israel -- which we have seen fulfilled in 1948, when the nation Israel returned to its homeland, the promised land given to Israel by God in the days of Moses and Joshua.
And, then we move on with Israel to the End Times, the seven year Tribulation, which is decreed by God as the time of refining for His chosen people, Israel. In the Tribulation, a remnant of Israel will come to faith in their Messiah, Jesus Christ -- and God will bring them through the times of trial, Jacob's Trouble, the Tribulation.
In Isaiah 10:20-23, we find, "Now in that day the remnant of Israel, and those of the house of Jacob who have escaped, will never again rely on the one who struck them (the Antichrist), but will truly rely on the LORD, the Holy One of Israel. A remnant will return, the remnant of Jacob, to the mighty God. For though your people, O Israel, may be like the sand of the sea, Only a remnant within them will return; A destruction is determined, overflowing with righteousness. For a complete destruction, one that is decreed, the Lord GOD of hosts will execute in the midst of the whole land."
This passage, while, at first, seeming to be symbolic, is truly to be read literally. God is going to put the nation Israel, and with them the Gentile nations, through a time of Tribulation. And, in this horrible seven year Tribulation, only a remnant of Israel will accept Jesus Christ as their Messiah and be saved. Although the Tribulation is not for the Gentile nations; many Gentiles will also be saved during the Tribulation. All others will perish with the Antichrist.
In Daniel 9:27, we read, "And he (the Antichrist) will make a firm covenant with the many (Israel) for one week (seven years), but in the middle of the week (3 1/2 years) he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate."
This passage uses symbolic language and is verified by Jesus Christ in Matthew 24.
In Matthew 24:15, we are told by Jesus Christ, "Therefore when you see the 'abomination of desolation,' spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place" (whoever reads, let him understand)." Here, Jesus Christ is referring to Daniel 9:27, the "abominations will come one who makes desolate."
This passage should be read literally; the Temple will be made desolate by the Antichrist at the midpoint of the seven year Tribulation.
The seven year Tribulation, the Time of Jacob's Trouble, will begin when the Antichrist signs a peace covenant with the nation Israel (Daniel 9:27). This will occur after the church has been raptured out of the world (1 Corinthians 15:50-53, 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18).
During the first 3 1/2 years there will be an unusual peace, or seeming peace, throughout the world. The Antichrist will somehow be able to bring the Jews and the Muslims together in an agreement which will allow the Jewish Temple to be rebuilt on the Temple Mount, where the large Islamic mosque now stands. It most likely will not replace the mosque; but, will share the Temple Mount with the mosque.
But, Israel will have her Temple once more and will be offering sacrifices to God in the newly rebuilt temple. However, in the middle of the seven years, after 42 months, the Antichrist will begin to show his true evil personality. It is my belief that this is the time when Satan actually enters and possesses the body of the Antichrist and all his evil is brought to the surface.
At this time, he will enter the Temple and declare himself to be God and demand worship. This is the "abomination of desolation" -- the "abominations will come one who makes desolate" spoken of in Daniel and by Jesus Christ.
This is the beginning of the Great Tribulation, the last 3 1/2 years of the Tribulation. From that midpoint on, the Antichrist will do everything in his power to completely destroy the nation Israel.
VP, do you see that so much of the Bible can be read literally -- and when He does use symbolism, He will give us an interpretation. He is not a God of confusion; He is not trying to hide His plan of salvation from us. He has given us His complete plan for our salvation and He has given us the Complete Christian User's Manual for living the Christian life. Believe me, there are no "trick questions" in the Bible. God says what He means -- and He means what He says!
And, that is the truth.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill
My Friend, VP, is in a church which reads the entire Bible as symbolism and allegory. So, his question is meant to be a "trick question" -- a "gotcha!" But, this is a very valid question and, I am sure is often confusing to Christian believers -- and, even more so, to new Christians and to new seekers only beginning their Biblical journey.
I pray that this dialogue will be a wee bit of help to you. If so, please feel free to share it with your Friends, Relatives, Associates, and Neighbors -- all your FRANs. Let's keep sharing the Word of God and the Gospel of Jesus Christ with all we meet -- until He returns.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill Gray
Hi to my Forum Friends,
In the discussion which I began titled "An Open Letter From The Son Of Madalyn Murray O'Hair" -- my Friend, VP, tells me, "But I would really like an answer to the question -- WHO decides which parts of the 'literal' word of God is symbolic? When there is no mention of symbolism in the text. I am really trying to follow your logic. Help me understand."
Thank you, VP. That is a valid question -- and a very good question. Since we know the Bible is the Holy Spirit inspired (authored by God), inerrant (authored by God, and God does not make mistakes), literal (God says what He means, and means what He says) Written Word of God -- there must be a way to know when to read the Bible literally and when to apply symbolism and allegory to our interpretation. Yes, there is, my Friend.
When studying the Bible, first, as you begin your study, you interpret the Scripture passage or verse you are reading literally. If this fits, and, you can tell if it makes sense -- that is the proper interpretation. If not, then look at that same passage under the lens of symbolism or allegory. If symbolism is used; you will be able to find the meaning for that symbolism in other parts of the Bible. This may require some dedicated study -- but, then, you are studying God's Word to gain more knowledge from it; so, what's a wee bit more work -- when the rewards are so great?
An example: In Revelation 1:16 we read, "In His right hand He held seven stars, and out of His mouth came a sharp two-edged sword; and His face was like the sun shining in its strength."
And, this symbolism is explained in Revelation 1:20, "As for the mystery of the seven stars which you saw in My right hand, and the seven golden lampstands: the seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches."
Another example is found in Ezekiel 37:1-10 when the prophet Ezekiel is given a prophetic vision by God.
Ezekiel 37:1-3, "The hand of the LORD was upon me, and He brought me out by the Spirit of the LORD and set me down in the middle of the valley; and it was full of bones. He caused me to pass among them round about, and behold, there were very many on the surface of the valley; and lo, they were very dry. He said to me, 'Son of man, can these bones live?" And I answered, "O Lord GOD, You know.'"
And, in Ezekiel 37:11 we find, "Then He said to me, "'on of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel;. . .'"
This passage is symbolic and allegorical -- and, at the same time, it is prophetic. It is prophesying about the future return of the nation so Israel -- which we have seen fulfilled in 1948, when the nation Israel returned to its homeland, the promised land given to Israel by God in the days of Moses and Joshua.
And, then we move on with Israel to the End Times, the seven year Tribulation, which is decreed by God as the time of refining for His chosen people, Israel. In the Tribulation, a remnant of Israel will come to faith in their Messiah, Jesus Christ -- and God will bring them through the times of trial, Jacob's Trouble, the Tribulation.
In Isaiah 10:20-23, we find, "Now in that day the remnant of Israel, and those of the house of Jacob who have escaped, will never again rely on the one who struck them (the Antichrist), but will truly rely on the LORD, the Holy One of Israel. A remnant will return, the remnant of Jacob, to the mighty God. For though your people, O Israel, may be like the sand of the sea, Only a remnant within them will return; A destruction is determined, overflowing with righteousness. For a complete destruction, one that is decreed, the Lord GOD of hosts will execute in the midst of the whole land."
This passage, while, at first, seeming to be symbolic, is truly to be read literally. God is going to put the nation Israel, and with them the Gentile nations, through a time of Tribulation. And, in this horrible seven year Tribulation, only a remnant of Israel will accept Jesus Christ as their Messiah and be saved. Although the Tribulation is not for the Gentile nations; many Gentiles will also be saved during the Tribulation. All others will perish with the Antichrist.
In Daniel 9:27, we read, "And he (the Antichrist) will make a firm covenant with the many (Israel) for one week (seven years), but in the middle of the week (3 1/2 years) he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate."
This passage uses symbolic language and is verified by Jesus Christ in Matthew 24.
In Matthew 24:15, we are told by Jesus Christ, "Therefore when you see the 'abomination of desolation,' spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place" (whoever reads, let him understand)." Here, Jesus Christ is referring to Daniel 9:27, the "abominations will come one who makes desolate."
This passage should be read literally; the Temple will be made desolate by the Antichrist at the midpoint of the seven year Tribulation.
The seven year Tribulation, the Time of Jacob's Trouble, will begin when the Antichrist signs a peace covenant with the nation Israel (Daniel 9:27). This will occur after the church has been raptured out of the world (1 Corinthians 15:50-53, 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18).
During the first 3 1/2 years there will be an unusual peace, or seeming peace, throughout the world. The Antichrist will somehow be able to bring the Jews and the Muslims together in an agreement which will allow the Jewish Temple to be rebuilt on the Temple Mount, where the large Islamic mosque now stands. It most likely will not replace the mosque; but, will share the Temple Mount with the mosque.
But, Israel will have her Temple once more and will be offering sacrifices to God in the newly rebuilt temple. However, in the middle of the seven years, after 42 months, the Antichrist will begin to show his true evil personality. It is my belief that this is the time when Satan actually enters and possesses the body of the Antichrist and all his evil is brought to the surface.
At this time, he will enter the Temple and declare himself to be God and demand worship. This is the "abomination of desolation" -- the "abominations will come one who makes desolate" spoken of in Daniel and by Jesus Christ.
This is the beginning of the Great Tribulation, the last 3 1/2 years of the Tribulation. From that midpoint on, the Antichrist will do everything in his power to completely destroy the nation Israel.
VP, do you see that so much of the Bible can be read literally -- and when He does use symbolism, He will give us an interpretation. He is not a God of confusion; He is not trying to hide His plan of salvation from us. He has given us His complete plan for our salvation and He has given us the Complete Christian User's Manual for living the Christian life. Believe me, there are no "trick questions" in the Bible. God says what He means -- and He means what He says!
And, that is the truth.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill
Tuesday, April 13, 2010
Get Your Ticket For The Glory Train!
How often have we gotten involved in a discussion about the days of Creation, the act of the Creation itself, evolution, the End Times, salvation, eternal security, etc.? Often these discussions are begun by seekers who are searching for the truth, while, even if he/she does not know it -- seeking God. But, many times, these issues are raised by atheists and secularists as smoke screens; in their attempts to sell their atheistic religion to those who are seeking or to those who have yet to mature in their knowledge of God's Word -- in an attempt to lure them away from God.
The dialogue below touches on several of these issues. I pray that you will find this informative and that you will share it with your
Friends, Relatives, Associates, and Neighbors -- all your FRANs. Let's keep sowing seeds, keep sharing God's Word, keep telling folks the Gospel of Jesus Christ -- until He returns.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill Gray
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Hi to my Forum Friends,
In the discussion "Fundamentalism and Moderates" begun by our atheist Friend, Deep, before his most recent banning from the TimesDaily Religion Forum -- and in a recent resurrection of this discussion by Jeeping; the subject of the days of Creation surfaced. In the course of this discussion, we have tiptoed through the time of the Creation, i.e., billions of years versus thousands of years. Then, someone tossed in the Gap Theory; a Liberal attempt to make God fit science. And, then, in Jeeping's recent revival, on to the actual days of Creation: Lunar days -- or periods of millions of years?
At this point, I suggested:
The Hebrew word for "day" is "yom" or "yohm" -- and the Greek word for "day" is "hemera." The word "day" -- in both Hebrew and Greek combined -- occurs 1741 times in 1541 verses in the KJV Bible. Of those instances, at least 80% or better refer to a lunar day, i.e, a 24 hour day. There are time when day does refer to a period of time; but, the great majority of the time, it refers to a lunar day.
Now, since we all know that God is capable of creating anything He desires in an instant, in the blink of an eye; the fact that He took six lunar days must have a significance.
God created the heavens and the earth, and all within this universe, including us -- in six lunar days and then He rested on the seventh. This is our model -- that we are to work six days and take a day of rest. The same with our domestic animals used for farming, etc. -- word six days and a day of rest.
Land produces more abundantly if it is planted for six years -- and allowed to lay fallow, uncultivated, during the seventh year.
Yes, God is pretty smart. But, He knew that we humans are not so much -- so, He set down guidelines -- both in His workings and in His Written Word, the Bible. All we have to do is to follow Him and His divine guidelines.
And, my Friend, Barbaro, responds,"I think if would be extremely arrogant for any of us, including Bill, to think we have an idea of how, when, and how much time it took, to create the earth.....it hurts my head to even think about it..."
And, Sofa chimes in with,"Science has a very good understanding of this verified through the convergence of multiple lines of evidence including geologic, cosmological, astronomical, molecular, radiometric, and a dozen other disciplines. It is simply incredible that we will have people living today in this electronic world that still accept the ramblings of the ancient wise men as literal truth. Bill, God gave us the ability to discern His creation through science. Denying science is to deny His gift to you. Willful ignorance just has to be a sin."
Sofa, my Friend, you have listed a number of fields or disciplines of science; but, the one thing you neglected to tell us is that all of these sciences, and all other sciences -- are subsets of Creation. When "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" (Genesis 1:1) -- that Creation included the complete spectrum of science and all the laws governing the sciences.
You tell us,"It is simply incredible that we will have people living today in this electronic world that still accept the ramblings of the ancient wise men as literal truth."
Not really incredible when one considers that the most Ancient and Wise, the One who authored all the writings in the Bible which you so frivolously denigrate -- is God Himself. Keep in mind that God is omniscient (all knowing), omnipotent (all powerful), and omnipresent (everywhere present) -- and, that He never has to say, "Oops!" And, this amazing "electronic world" -- guess who gave us the knowledge to create it? Yep! You guess it! GOD!
Then, you tell us,"Bill, God gave us the ability to discern His creation through science. Denying science is to deny His gift to you. Willful ignorance just has to be a sin."
Let's break this down. First,"Bill, God gave us the ability to discern His creation through science."
That is true. But, limiting His Creation to the unfinished fields of science -- is analogous to trying to define the miracle of conception and birth -- by examining the birth control pill.
Then,"Denying science is to deny His gift to you."
Who is denying science? We are merely putting science in its proper perspective, a subset of Creation. I have spent my entire adult working life in the computer field. I began working on computers when they were built from vacuum tubes. If you do not know what a vacuum tube is; ask your grandparents or some other mature person. I worked on and with computers through the vacuum tube era, the transistor era, the integrated circuit era, the VLSI (very large scale integrated circuit) era -- I was teaching seminars and courses on microcomputers before there were such things as PCs (personal computers) and Apples/MACs.
So, I would say that the world of science has been good to me -- and I have great respect for science -- and enjoy studying it. And, I thank God for all the science breakthroughs He has given us.
With all that said -- yes, the Creation was six lunar (24 hours) days -- and God rested on the seventh. If you will go back and study Genesis you will notice that for each of the six days of Creation, each always ends with, "And there was evening and there was morning, the Xth day." But, for the seventh day, this does not occur. Why? Do you suppose it is because we are still in God's day of rest -- and will be until He has finished His intended purpose -- that of bringing all who will, by grace, through faith in Jesus Christ; into eternal fellowship with Himself.
I am counted in that eternal fellowship. Are you? As long as your are still breathing on this earth -- it is not to late to accept your "free" ticket on that Glory Train. After you last breath here; your eternal destination is set in concrete. God never has to say, "Oops!" -- but, after this life, He will never say, "Try again!"
But, let me emphasize one more time; we are not saved by what we believe about the Creation; nor how many years we believe it took God to accomplish His masterpiece. We are not saved by what we believe about the End Times, nor how we view baptism, etc.
We are saved -- by the grace of God, through faith in Jesus Christ -- plus NOTHING else (Ephesians 2:8-9). All the other issues we can discuss, we can debate -- but, we should be willing to occasionally agree to disagree. We should NEVER allow these issues to become divisive among Christian believers.
I will end by saying that Genesis 1:1, "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" -- is the foundation stone of our Bible. If this is not true; how can we believe anything else in the Bible? And, that is exactly why the atheists will fight so hard to disprove the act of Creation.
And, John 1:1, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God" (John 1:1) -- is the foundation stone of our Christian faith. If this is not true, if Jesus Christ is not deity, if Jesus Christ is not God -- then none of us have a hope. And, that is exactly why the atheists will fight so hard to deny God and to deny Jesus Christ. This is Satan's futile attempt to defeat Christ.
To close the Biblical parenthetical declaration -- we have Revelation 22:13, "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end." and in Revelation 22:20, "He who testifies to these things says, 'Yes, I am coming quickly.' Amen. Come, Lord Jesus."
So, my Friends, let's discuss all the Biblical issues; let's enjoy occasionally butting heads over issues; let's present our positions and allow others to present theirs; let's agree or refute those positions -- for these type discussions, which I liken to a good Bible study, will help us all grow and mature in our knowledge of God's Word. But, let us never allow these discussions to become divisive among Christian brothers and sisters. And, let's encourage our non-believing Friends to join our discussions -- for we never know which small seed may grow into eternal salvation for just one more person.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill
The dialogue below touches on several of these issues. I pray that you will find this informative and that you will share it with your
Friends, Relatives, Associates, and Neighbors -- all your FRANs. Let's keep sowing seeds, keep sharing God's Word, keep telling folks the Gospel of Jesus Christ -- until He returns.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill Gray
Hi to my Forum Friends,
In the discussion "Fundamentalism and Moderates" begun by our atheist Friend, Deep, before his most recent banning from the TimesDaily Religion Forum -- and in a recent resurrection of this discussion by Jeeping; the subject of the days of Creation surfaced. In the course of this discussion, we have tiptoed through the time of the Creation, i.e., billions of years versus thousands of years. Then, someone tossed in the Gap Theory; a Liberal attempt to make God fit science. And, then, in Jeeping's recent revival, on to the actual days of Creation: Lunar days -- or periods of millions of years?
At this point, I suggested:
The Hebrew word for "day" is "yom" or "yohm" -- and the Greek word for "day" is "hemera." The word "day" -- in both Hebrew and Greek combined -- occurs 1741 times in 1541 verses in the KJV Bible. Of those instances, at least 80% or better refer to a lunar day, i.e, a 24 hour day. There are time when day does refer to a period of time; but, the great majority of the time, it refers to a lunar day.
Now, since we all know that God is capable of creating anything He desires in an instant, in the blink of an eye; the fact that He took six lunar days must have a significance.
God created the heavens and the earth, and all within this universe, including us -- in six lunar days and then He rested on the seventh. This is our model -- that we are to work six days and take a day of rest. The same with our domestic animals used for farming, etc. -- word six days and a day of rest.
Land produces more abundantly if it is planted for six years -- and allowed to lay fallow, uncultivated, during the seventh year.
Yes, God is pretty smart. But, He knew that we humans are not so much -- so, He set down guidelines -- both in His workings and in His Written Word, the Bible. All we have to do is to follow Him and His divine guidelines.
And, my Friend, Barbaro, responds,
And, Sofa chimes in with,
Sofa, my Friend, you have listed a number of fields or disciplines of science; but, the one thing you neglected to tell us is that all of these sciences, and all other sciences -- are subsets of Creation. When "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" (Genesis 1:1) -- that Creation included the complete spectrum of science and all the laws governing the sciences.
You tell us,
Not really incredible when one considers that the most Ancient and Wise, the One who authored all the writings in the Bible which you so frivolously denigrate -- is God Himself. Keep in mind that God is omniscient (all knowing), omnipotent (all powerful), and omnipresent (everywhere present) -- and, that He never has to say, "Oops!" And, this amazing "electronic world" -- guess who gave us the knowledge to create it? Yep! You guess it! GOD!
Then, you tell us,
Let's break this down. First,
That is true. But, limiting His Creation to the unfinished fields of science -- is analogous to trying to define the miracle of conception and birth -- by examining the birth control pill.
Then,
Who is denying science? We are merely putting science in its proper perspective, a subset of Creation. I have spent my entire adult working life in the computer field. I began working on computers when they were built from vacuum tubes. If you do not know what a vacuum tube is; ask your grandparents or some other mature person. I worked on and with computers through the vacuum tube era, the transistor era, the integrated circuit era, the VLSI (very large scale integrated circuit) era -- I was teaching seminars and courses on microcomputers before there were such things as PCs (personal computers) and Apples/MACs.
So, I would say that the world of science has been good to me -- and I have great respect for science -- and enjoy studying it. And, I thank God for all the science breakthroughs He has given us.
With all that said -- yes, the Creation was six lunar (24 hours) days -- and God rested on the seventh. If you will go back and study Genesis you will notice that for each of the six days of Creation, each always ends with, "And there was evening and there was morning, the Xth day." But, for the seventh day, this does not occur. Why? Do you suppose it is because we are still in God's day of rest -- and will be until He has finished His intended purpose -- that of bringing all who will, by grace, through faith in Jesus Christ; into eternal fellowship with Himself.
I am counted in that eternal fellowship. Are you? As long as your are still breathing on this earth -- it is not to late to accept your "free" ticket on that Glory Train. After you last breath here; your eternal destination is set in concrete. God never has to say, "Oops!" -- but, after this life, He will never say, "Try again!"
But, let me emphasize one more time; we are not saved by what we believe about the Creation; nor how many years we believe it took God to accomplish His masterpiece. We are not saved by what we believe about the End Times, nor how we view baptism, etc.
We are saved -- by the grace of God, through faith in Jesus Christ -- plus NOTHING else (Ephesians 2:8-9). All the other issues we can discuss, we can debate -- but, we should be willing to occasionally agree to disagree. We should NEVER allow these issues to become divisive among Christian believers.
I will end by saying that Genesis 1:1, "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth" -- is the foundation stone of our Bible. If this is not true; how can we believe anything else in the Bible? And, that is exactly why the atheists will fight so hard to disprove the act of Creation.
And, John 1:1, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God" (John 1:1) -- is the foundation stone of our Christian faith. If this is not true, if Jesus Christ is not deity, if Jesus Christ is not God -- then none of us have a hope. And, that is exactly why the atheists will fight so hard to deny God and to deny Jesus Christ. This is Satan's futile attempt to defeat Christ.
To close the Biblical parenthetical declaration -- we have Revelation 22:13, "I am the Alpha and the Omega, the first and the last, the beginning and the end." and in Revelation 22:20, "He who testifies to these things says, 'Yes, I am coming quickly.' Amen. Come, Lord Jesus."
So, my Friends, let's discuss all the Biblical issues; let's enjoy occasionally butting heads over issues; let's present our positions and allow others to present theirs; let's agree or refute those positions -- for these type discussions, which I liken to a good Bible study, will help us all grow and mature in our knowledge of God's Word. But, let us never allow these discussions to become divisive among Christian brothers and sisters. And, let's encourage our non-believing Friends to join our discussions -- for we never know which small seed may grow into eternal salvation for just one more person.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill
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