ARE YOU INTERESTED IN END TIMES PROPHECIES? If not, why not? Do you even know what your local church believes and teaches about End Times Prophecies?
"Okay, Bill, so what is the big deal about wanting to know about future things? Let's just live today and be good Christians." Really?
Many folks pay lots of money to have New Age charlatans, i.e., psychics, mediums, fortune tellers, etc., erroneously tell them what their future holds. When, for the price of a Bible and your time - you can know what will happen in your future. And, that is not important, really?
One third of the Bible is prophecy. Would God allocate that much of His Bible, His Written Word, to prophecy - if it were not important? And, while we find prophecy in many of the 39 books of the Old Testament, only one of the 27 books of the New Testament is dedicated to prophesy, Revelation. In other words, God has given us one book in the New Testament, Revelation, to be the summation of all His prophetic writings, the closing of created time on this earth.
And yet many folks, even churches and pastors, avoid that one very important book. Why? Because it make use of symbolism, metaphors, etc.? Actually, that is why many theologians, scholars, pastors, and teachers will attempt to "spiritualize" the book of Revelation - and then avoid teaching it. Revelation can be read and taught the same as any other book of the Bible. Read it as you would any other book, literally. He is not a God of confusion (1 Corinthians 14:33).
Begin reading Scripture literally. Most often that will fit. If not, then look at it through symbolic, metaphorical, or maybe poetic eyes. That method will fit for all 66 books of the Bible.
Keep in mind that when God inspired John to write the book of Revelation many of those events would have been totally foreign to John in 95 AD. So, how was God going to tell us, in our modern day culture and language, using John as His earthly writer in the first century - about events which John could not possibly conceive back then? So, should the book of Revelation be read literally? Yes, where it can be read literally. If a literal interpretation does not fit - try a symbolic or metaphorical reading.
The following excerpts give a good guideline for interpreting what the Bible is telling us, in Revelation, or in any other book:
So, in your local church fellowship, every person should know and understand the Statement of Faith which guides the beliefs and teachings of your local church. And in that Statement of Faith you should be able to find what your church believes and teaches about End Times Prophecies, i.e., Eschatology.
But, a very important point: Your eschatological belief does NOT affect your salvation. Because a person does not believe in a PreTribulational Rapture - does not mean that person is not a saved believer. So why worry about which belief our local church holds and teaches? Glad you asked. As a PreTribulation Rapture believer, while I study and understand eschatology and the horrible Tribulation which I know is going to occur - I also have peace with God knowing that my family and I will be gone from this fallen world BEFORE the Antichrist start his murdering rampage throughout the whole earth.
So, why learn about the Tribulation and eschatology? Let me throw that question back to you. "Are you a believer who has loved ones, family and friends, who are not yet saved?"
Would you want them to go through the horrible seven years of Tribulation and most likely be tortured and murdered by the Antichrist? No? Then how do YOU prevent that from happening? You share Jesus Christ with them - and you keep on sharing with them at every opportunity. You invite them to Bible studies and to your church worship service.
Part of sharing the Gospel is also understanding and sharing the consequences of not believing. NO, I am not suggesting that you beat them over the head with your Bible. But, I am suggesting that you make sure you know your Bible, including eschatology, and how to share it with your loved ones and friends. So that when the opportunity comes - you are prepared to be His witness to them.
Personally, I am thoroughly convinced that the Bible teaches a PreTribulational Rapture of the church (all people worldwide, from the Day of Pentecost until the Rapture occurs, who believe and have put their faith in Jesus Christ) ~ and a PreMillennial Second Coming of Jesus Christ to establish His Millennial Kingdom on earth, from the throne of David in the city of Jerusalem, where He will rule all the earth for 1000 years, the perfect theocracy.
That said, the purpose of this blog is to introduce you a series of videos titled "End Times Seminar" presented by a Bible teacher named Paul Dorgan who lives in Tuscon, Arizona. This is the intro to the seminar:
While Paul Dorgan is a Facebook Friend, at first I was reluctant to present his series of End Times teachings to all my Friends. Why? Well, as I said earlier, I am a PreTrib/PreMillennial believer - and Paul believes in a PreWrath Rapture. But I did watch his full video "End Times Seminar Session 3 - Four Views of the Rapture" and found that, although we hold differing views on the timing of the Rapture - he does present and explain all four views fairly and very well. I never felt that he was putting down my PreTrib Rapture view.
I know that YOU will learn a lot about the End Times through watching Paul's series of videos. However, since my main focus at this time is on the Rapture, I am suggesting you start with that video first:
That said, let me share a few of the points in his video where I would have a discussion with him:
(1) At the 25:16 minute point in the video, he speaks of the PreTrib Rapture view as meaning that the Second Coming of Christ will be in "two phases." First a "secret coming" and then His "physical coming." That is not what is taught in Scripture and not what we in the PreTrib camp believe. We who are PreTrib see the Rapture and the Second Coming as two totally separate events - separated by seven years. The Rapture being Imminent - His Second Coming 7 years later.
(2) At the 26 minute point in the video, he speaks of the Judgment Seat of Christ - 2 Corinthians 5:10. I agree with him, this is the Believers' Judgment which I believe happens during the Rapture for that is when we will receive our immortal bodies and, I believe, our robes of "fine linen, clean and bright, for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints" (Revelation 19:8). But I suppose we could receive our immortal bodies at the Rapture - and later our "righteousness robes" when in heaven - but before the Wedding Feast of the Lamb (Revelation 19:6-9).
(3) At the 27:39 minute point, he tells us that 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 and John 14:1-3 speak of the Rapture, but not the timing of the Rapture. That is true. Yet, when we stand those Scripture passages alongside other Scripture passages which DO tell us we will NOT endure the wrath (Romans 5:9, 1 Thessalonians 1:10, 1 Thessalonians 5:9, Revelation 3:10) - we get a full picture of the Rapture and its timing, i.e., and, Biblically, it can only be a PreTrib Rapture.
(4) At the 30:35 minute point, he tells us that, in the PreWrath Rapture, God's Wrath is only for a short time at the end of the 7-year Tribulation, plus 30 days. Yet, God tells us that the Tribulation is His Refiner's Fire (Malachi 3:2, Zechariah 13:7-9) intended to bring the remnant of His chosen people, Israel, to faith and belief in their Messiah, Jesus Christ.
Since the Tribulation is God's Refiner's Fire for His chosen people, Israel - why would He pour out His Wrath only during a short time at the end of the Tribulation? Since the gathering of the remnant of His chosen people is His primary purpose of the Tribulation - and His wrath is the Refiner's Fire - why not just have a shorter Tribulation, i.e., maybe only 3 1/2 years if the MidTrib view is correct, or only 1 1/2 years if the PreWrath view is correct? Why drag out the Tribulation for 7 years if His intent is fulfilled in 1 1/2 years or in 3 1/2 years?
And, let's look at the PostTrib Rapture belief, that God will allow all believers to go through the 7 year Tribulation - but He will protect us from harm during all that wrath. Why would He make us live through and witness all the misery and horror of the full Tribulation - since He does not want us harmed by it? Would YOU allow your Bride to undergo 7 years of misery and pain - before you wed her? I sure would not - and I am sure God would not either.
(5) At the 39 minute point, he suggests that in the PreWrath Rapture view, the saints which the Antichrist is killing in Revelation 13:7 includes both the yet-to-be raptured church and the Tribulation saints. And in the PreWrath view many of those who will be killed, martyred, by the Antichrist - will include the Bride of Christ. Does that sound reasonable that Christ would choose us as His Bride - and then let us go through the Antichrist's killing period? Let's look closer at Scripture:
If the PreWrath view is correct - then you and I, the Bride of Christ, could also be Tribulation martyrs. Yet, the Bible tells us the church (all believers during the church age) is the Bride of Christ. How could we be both the Bride of Christ - and Tribulation martyrs? Revelation 7:9 tells us that the multitude to large to count who have died during the Tribulation - are the Tribulation saints, i.e., martyrs - not the church, not the Bride of Christ.
Several places in the video he speaks of the "Predictability" of the Rapture. That is just another way of saying the "Imminence" of the Rapture.
He began as a PreTrib Rapture believer, but has studied End Times Scripture for 20 years and is now convinced that the PreWrath Rapture view is correct.
I have been studying End Times Scripture for 26 years and am absolutely convinced that the PreTrib Rapture view is what the Bible teaches.
What is the gating factor which determines which view is correct? Christ tells us that NO ONE can know the day or the hour, i.e., the Rapture is IMMINENT!
Not sure if it was an oversight, or if it was done on purpose. But in the video several times he mentionsPredictability, i.e., Imminence, in reference to the MidTrib Rapture view and the PostTrib Rapture view. Yet, for whatever reason he never mentions Predictability (Imminence) when speaking of the PreWrath Rapture view. Why not?
For any other Rapture view to be true - except the PreTrib Rapture view - the doctrine of Imminence must be false. And that would mean that in Matthew 24:36, "But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only" - Jesus was not telling the truth. We know that is not possible. Therefore only the PreTrib Rapture view can be correct.
He tells us he will prove the PreWrath Rapture from Scripture. And, he mentioned two proponents of PreWrath Rapture, Rosenthal and Van Kampen. I have both Marvin Rosenthal's book "The PreWrath Rapture Of The Church" (319 pages) and Robert Van Kampen's book "The Sign" (544 pages). Both of them claim to prove the PreWrath Rapture view from Scripture. However, BOTH authors dance around - but still deny - the doctrine of the Imminent coming of Christ to Rapture His church. To teach a PreWrath Rapture, one MUST deny the Imminence of the Rapture.
In conclusion, I do recommend you watch Paul Dorgan's End Time Seminar videos - but as he suggested, do it with your Bible in your hands and with an open, clear mind which will allow you to not only learn - but to discern where you feel your Scripture interpretation may differ from what is presented. I intend to watch all eight videos.
Keep digging into Scripture. For there you will find the Mother Lode of knowledge, wisdom, inspiration, and joy - and the Golden Nuggets will never cease.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill
"Okay, Bill, so what is the big deal about wanting to know about future things? Let's just live today and be good Christians." Really?
Many folks pay lots of money to have New Age charlatans, i.e., psychics, mediums, fortune tellers, etc., erroneously tell them what their future holds. When, for the price of a Bible and your time - you can know what will happen in your future. And, that is not important, really?
One third of the Bible is prophecy. Would God allocate that much of His Bible, His Written Word, to prophecy - if it were not important? And, while we find prophecy in many of the 39 books of the Old Testament, only one of the 27 books of the New Testament is dedicated to prophesy, Revelation. In other words, God has given us one book in the New Testament, Revelation, to be the summation of all His prophetic writings, the closing of created time on this earth.
And yet many folks, even churches and pastors, avoid that one very important book. Why? Because it make use of symbolism, metaphors, etc.? Actually, that is why many theologians, scholars, pastors, and teachers will attempt to "spiritualize" the book of Revelation - and then avoid teaching it. Revelation can be read and taught the same as any other book of the Bible. Read it as you would any other book, literally. He is not a God of confusion (1 Corinthians 14:33).
Begin reading Scripture literally. Most often that will fit. If not, then look at it through symbolic, metaphorical, or maybe poetic eyes. That method will fit for all 66 books of the Bible.
Keep in mind that when God inspired John to write the book of Revelation many of those events would have been totally foreign to John in 95 AD. So, how was God going to tell us, in our modern day culture and language, using John as His earthly writer in the first century - about events which John could not possibly conceive back then? So, should the book of Revelation be read literally? Yes, where it can be read literally. If a literal interpretation does not fit - try a symbolic or metaphorical reading.
The following excerpts give a good guideline for interpreting what the Bible is telling us, in Revelation, or in any other book:
Biblical hermeneutics is the study of the principles and methods of interpreting the text of the Bible. . . . The most important law of Biblical hermeneutics is that the Bible should be interpreted literally. We are to understand the Bible in its normal or plain meaning, unless the passage is obviously intended to be symbolic or if figures of speech are employed. The Bible says what it means and means what it says. . . .
Some interpreters make the mistake of trying to read between the lines of Scripture to come up with esoteric meanings that are not truly in the text, as if every passage has a hidden spiritual truth that we should seek to decrypt. Biblical hermeneutics keeps us faithful to the intended meaning of Scripture and away from allegorizing Bible verses that should be understood literally.
A second crucial law of Biblical hermeneutics is that passages must be interpreted historically, grammatically, and contextually.
Interpreting a passage historically means we must seek to understand the culture, background, and situation that prompted the text. . . .
Interpreting a passage grammatically requires one to follow the rules of grammar and recognize the nuances of Hebrew and Greek. . . .
Bill Gray Note: One does not have to be a Hebrew or Greek scholar to interpret a Scripture verse. For example, I use the Blue Letter Bible online (http://www.blbclassic.org/index.cfm) to help me study Scripture. The BLB has a number of nice features: It allows us to read the Scripture in virtually all translations. It allows us to open the Concordance for each verse showing the words or phrases in Greek and Hebrew, along with their Biblical meaning. And, it has many good commentaries, written and audio, from many solid Bible teachers and scholars.
Interpreting a passage contextually involves considering the context of a verse or passage when trying to determine the meaning. The context includes the verses immediately preceding and following, (also) the chapter, the book, and, most broadly, the entire Bible. . . .
A third law of biblical hermeneutics is that Scripture is always the best interpreter of Scripture. For this reason, we always compare Scripture with Scripture when trying to determine the meaning of a passage. . . .Bill Gray Note: In other words, do not attempt to stand one or two Scripture verses alone - and build a theology out of them. All Scripture must be able to stand alongside all other relevant Scripture verses or passages - and be in agreement.
Some people avoid studying biblical hermeneutics because they mistakenly believe it will limit their ability to learn new truths from God’s Word or stifle the Holy Spirit’s illumination of Scripture. But their fears are unfounded. Biblical hermeneutics is all about finding the correct interpretation of the inspired text. The purpose of Biblical hermeneutics is to protect us from misapplying Scripture or allowing bias (a predetermined theology) to color our understanding of truth. ("What is biblical hermeneutics?" - https://www.gotquestions.org/Biblical-hermeneutics.html)
So, in your local church fellowship, every person should know and understand the Statement of Faith which guides the beliefs and teachings of your local church. And in that Statement of Faith you should be able to find what your church believes and teaches about End Times Prophecies, i.e., Eschatology.
But, a very important point: Your eschatological belief does NOT affect your salvation. Because a person does not believe in a PreTribulational Rapture - does not mean that person is not a saved believer. So why worry about which belief our local church holds and teaches? Glad you asked. As a PreTribulation Rapture believer, while I study and understand eschatology and the horrible Tribulation which I know is going to occur - I also have peace with God knowing that my family and I will be gone from this fallen world BEFORE the Antichrist start his murdering rampage throughout the whole earth.
So, why learn about the Tribulation and eschatology? Let me throw that question back to you. "Are you a believer who has loved ones, family and friends, who are not yet saved?"
Would you want them to go through the horrible seven years of Tribulation and most likely be tortured and murdered by the Antichrist? No? Then how do YOU prevent that from happening? You share Jesus Christ with them - and you keep on sharing with them at every opportunity. You invite them to Bible studies and to your church worship service.
Part of sharing the Gospel is also understanding and sharing the consequences of not believing. NO, I am not suggesting that you beat them over the head with your Bible. But, I am suggesting that you make sure you know your Bible, including eschatology, and how to share it with your loved ones and friends. So that when the opportunity comes - you are prepared to be His witness to them.
Personally, I am thoroughly convinced that the Bible teaches a PreTribulational Rapture of the church (all people worldwide, from the Day of Pentecost until the Rapture occurs, who believe and have put their faith in Jesus Christ) ~ and a PreMillennial Second Coming of Jesus Christ to establish His Millennial Kingdom on earth, from the throne of David in the city of Jerusalem, where He will rule all the earth for 1000 years, the perfect theocracy.
That said, the purpose of this blog is to introduce you a series of videos titled "End Times Seminar" presented by a Bible teacher named Paul Dorgan who lives in Tuscon, Arizona. This is the intro to the seminar:
My name is Paul Dorgan. Welcome to my YouTube Channel. This channel has 8 videos from an 8-Session Seminar that I teach on the End Times. The Seminar is based completely on taking the Bible "in-context" and by allowing Scripture to interpret Scripture. The goal of the Seminar is to get you thinking about the End Times and to help prepare you for the future. Various viewpoints will be presented - and I encourage you to only believe what the Scriptures convince you to believe. Each of the Sessions builds upon the previous Session so I would encourage you to watch them in order.
While Paul Dorgan is a Facebook Friend, at first I was reluctant to present his series of End Times teachings to all my Friends. Why? Well, as I said earlier, I am a PreTrib/PreMillennial believer - and Paul believes in a PreWrath Rapture. But I did watch his full video "End Times Seminar Session 3 - Four Views of the Rapture" and found that, although we hold differing views on the timing of the Rapture - he does present and explain all four views fairly and very well. I never felt that he was putting down my PreTrib Rapture view.
I know that YOU will learn a lot about the End Times through watching Paul's series of videos. However, since my main focus at this time is on the Rapture, I am suggesting you start with that video first:
End Times Seminar Session 3 - Four Views of the Rapture https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PiKBysLf6MQ&list=PLPn6vbECVITq0blaxTebxYRKk008MnkMJ&index=3
That said, let me share a few of the points in his video where I would have a discussion with him:
(1) At the 25:16 minute point in the video, he speaks of the PreTrib Rapture view as meaning that the Second Coming of Christ will be in "two phases." First a "secret coming" and then His "physical coming." That is not what is taught in Scripture and not what we in the PreTrib camp believe. We who are PreTrib see the Rapture and the Second Coming as two totally separate events - separated by seven years. The Rapture being Imminent - His Second Coming 7 years later.
(2) At the 26 minute point in the video, he speaks of the Judgment Seat of Christ - 2 Corinthians 5:10. I agree with him, this is the Believers' Judgment which I believe happens during the Rapture for that is when we will receive our immortal bodies and, I believe, our robes of "fine linen, clean and bright, for the fine linen is the righteous acts of the saints" (Revelation 19:8). But I suppose we could receive our immortal bodies at the Rapture - and later our "righteousness robes" when in heaven - but before the Wedding Feast of the Lamb (Revelation 19:6-9).
(3) At the 27:39 minute point, he tells us that 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 and John 14:1-3 speak of the Rapture, but not the timing of the Rapture. That is true. Yet, when we stand those Scripture passages alongside other Scripture passages which DO tell us we will NOT endure the wrath (Romans 5:9, 1 Thessalonians 1:10, 1 Thessalonians 5:9, Revelation 3:10) - we get a full picture of the Rapture and its timing, i.e., and, Biblically, it can only be a PreTrib Rapture.
(4) At the 30:35 minute point, he tells us that, in the PreWrath Rapture, God's Wrath is only for a short time at the end of the 7-year Tribulation, plus 30 days. Yet, God tells us that the Tribulation is His Refiner's Fire (Malachi 3:2, Zechariah 13:7-9) intended to bring the remnant of His chosen people, Israel, to faith and belief in their Messiah, Jesus Christ.
Since the Tribulation is God's Refiner's Fire for His chosen people, Israel - why would He pour out His Wrath only during a short time at the end of the Tribulation? Since the gathering of the remnant of His chosen people is His primary purpose of the Tribulation - and His wrath is the Refiner's Fire - why not just have a shorter Tribulation, i.e., maybe only 3 1/2 years if the MidTrib view is correct, or only 1 1/2 years if the PreWrath view is correct? Why drag out the Tribulation for 7 years if His intent is fulfilled in 1 1/2 years or in 3 1/2 years?
And, let's look at the PostTrib Rapture belief, that God will allow all believers to go through the 7 year Tribulation - but He will protect us from harm during all that wrath. Why would He make us live through and witness all the misery and horror of the full Tribulation - since He does not want us harmed by it? Would YOU allow your Bride to undergo 7 years of misery and pain - before you wed her? I sure would not - and I am sure God would not either.
(5) At the 39 minute point, he suggests that in the PreWrath Rapture view, the saints which the Antichrist is killing in Revelation 13:7 includes both the yet-to-be raptured church and the Tribulation saints. And in the PreWrath view many of those who will be killed, martyred, by the Antichrist - will include the Bride of Christ. Does that sound reasonable that Christ would choose us as His Bride - and then let us go through the Antichrist's killing period? Let's look closer at Scripture:
Revelation 13:7, "It was granted to him (the Antichrist) to make war with the saints and to overcome them. And authority was given him over every tribe, tongue, and nation."
Revelation 7:9, 13-14, "After these things I looked, and behold, a great multitude which no one could number, of all nations, tribes, peoples, and tongues, standing before the throne and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, with palm branches in their hands, . . . Then one of the elders answered, saying to me, 'Who are these arrayed in white robes, and where did they come from?' And I said to him, 'Sir, you know.' So he said to me, 'These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.'"
If the PreWrath view is correct - then you and I, the Bride of Christ, could also be Tribulation martyrs. Yet, the Bible tells us the church (all believers during the church age) is the Bride of Christ. How could we be both the Bride of Christ - and Tribulation martyrs? Revelation 7:9 tells us that the multitude to large to count who have died during the Tribulation - are the Tribulation saints, i.e., martyrs - not the church, not the Bride of Christ.
Several places in the video he speaks of the "Predictability" of the Rapture. That is just another way of saying the "Imminence" of the Rapture.
He began as a PreTrib Rapture believer, but has studied End Times Scripture for 20 years and is now convinced that the PreWrath Rapture view is correct.
I have been studying End Times Scripture for 26 years and am absolutely convinced that the PreTrib Rapture view is what the Bible teaches.
What is the gating factor which determines which view is correct? Christ tells us that NO ONE can know the day or the hour, i.e., the Rapture is IMMINENT!
Not sure if it was an oversight, or if it was done on purpose. But in the video several times he mentionsPredictability, i.e., Imminence, in reference to the MidTrib Rapture view and the PostTrib Rapture view. Yet, for whatever reason he never mentions Predictability (Imminence) when speaking of the PreWrath Rapture view. Why not?
For any other Rapture view to be true - except the PreTrib Rapture view - the doctrine of Imminence must be false. And that would mean that in Matthew 24:36, "But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, but My Father only" - Jesus was not telling the truth. We know that is not possible. Therefore only the PreTrib Rapture view can be correct.
He tells us he will prove the PreWrath Rapture from Scripture. And, he mentioned two proponents of PreWrath Rapture, Rosenthal and Van Kampen. I have both Marvin Rosenthal's book "The PreWrath Rapture Of The Church" (319 pages) and Robert Van Kampen's book "The Sign" (544 pages). Both of them claim to prove the PreWrath Rapture view from Scripture. However, BOTH authors dance around - but still deny - the doctrine of the Imminent coming of Christ to Rapture His church. To teach a PreWrath Rapture, one MUST deny the Imminence of the Rapture.
In conclusion, I do recommend you watch Paul Dorgan's End Time Seminar videos - but as he suggested, do it with your Bible in your hands and with an open, clear mind which will allow you to not only learn - but to discern where you feel your Scripture interpretation may differ from what is presented. I intend to watch all eight videos.
End Times Seminar Session 1 - Introduction & Millennium
End Times Seminar Session 2 - Prophecy of the 70 Weeks
End Times Seminar Session 3 - Four Views of the Rapture
End Times Seminar Session 4 - The Day of the Lord
End Times Seminar Session 5 - Chronology of 70th Week
End Times Seminar Session 6 - Three Distinct Periods of 70th Week
End Times Seminar Session 7 - The Beginning Wrath of God
End Times Seminar Session 8 - The Final Wrath of God
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLPn6vbECVITq0blaxTebxYRKk008MnkMJ
Keep digging into Scripture. For there you will find the Mother Lode of knowledge, wisdom, inspiration, and joy - and the Golden Nuggets will never cease.
God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,
Bill
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