My Thoughts On Kenneth Copeland And Rick Warren

On Facebook Today A Post Declared Rick Warren "America's Pastor"  ~  Let me set the record straight.  I have been a Conservative Christian of the Baptist Flavor for 33 years - and Rick Warren would NEVER be my pastor.  But rather than just saying that, let me explain by sharing an e-mail dialogue from 2014.  A long time Christian brother and Friend sent me an e-mail asking:

Uncle Bill!
 
How are you?  What are your thoughts on Kenneth Copeland and his teaching/ministries?   Also Rick Warren, and the Purpose Driven Church/Teachings.  Just basic, simple thoughts please!  I know what I am thinking, but want confirmation from a fellow believer!  Thanks, Paul

~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~ ~

My thoughts on Kenneth Copeland:

He is absolutely a "Name It And Claim It" Prosperity preacher, aka "Word of Faith" Movement - cut along the same lines as Fred Price, Benny Hinn, Kenneth Hagin, Paul Crouch, Creflo Dollar, Oral Roberts, Joel Osteen, et al.

I have heard him teach that God is about 6'3" tall, weighing about 200 pounds.  From a web site:  

• God is a spirit-being with a body, complete with eyes, and eyelids, ears, nostrils, a mouth, hands and fingers, and feet. (Kenneth Copeland ministry letter, 21 July 1977.)
  
  
• The Bible said He measured the heavens with a 9 inch span.  Now the span is the difference, distance between the end of the thumb and the end of the little Finger. And, and that Bible said, in fact the amplified translation translates the Hebrew text that way.  That He measured out the heavens with a 9 inch span.  Well, I got a ruler and measured mine, and my span’s 8 3/4 inches long.  So now God’s span is a quarter of an inch, a quarter inch longer than mine. 
  
  So you see, that faith didn’t come billowing out of some giant monster somewhere.  It came out of the heart of a being that is very uncanny the way He’s very much like you and me.  A being that stands somewhere around 6′ 2 , 6′ 3, that weighs somewhere in the neighborhood of a couple of hundred pounds, little better, has a span of 8 and, I mean nine inches across – stood up and said Light be [Let it be?], and this universe situated itself and went into motion.  Glory to God. (Spirit, Soul, and a Body 1 1985, audio tape #01-0601, side 1)

You can find other interesting quotes and info regarding Kenneth Copeland at:  https://www.coursehero.com/file/p5i6is03/The-Form-that-I-saw-was-about-the-height-of-a-man-six-feet-tall-maybe-a-little/

I personally saw him on the 700 Club about ten years ago.  He was there to push his new book on prayer.  And speaking to Pat Robertson, he said that his new book teaches that, "When you pray, NEVER pray, 'Lord, Your will be done!'  That would be a sin."   Yet, in the garden of Gethsemane Jesus prayed, "Father, not My will, but Your will be done."   So according to Kenneth Copeland - Jesus sinned when He prayed that prayer.

Regarding Rick Warren:

I believe he is a sincere Christian believer - and I believe he started out on the right track.  But I believe he was pulled astray by Robert Schuller:  Schuller's Church Leadership/Marketing program, Schuller's World Religion Ecumenical program, and Schuller's Reform/Social Theology.   The best I can say about Rick Warren now is that he is a sincere Christian believer who teaches a Social Theology - more than a Salvation Theology.

Several years ago he started new "health related" programs in his church.   But none of the three men he put in charge of the program were Christians.  A pastor does not promote men to leadership in the church who are not believers; but Rick Warren did.

A funny side note on that incident:  When I saw this program being announced on Facebook, I wrote a response saying that I do not agree and and that I believe a pastor should only appoint Christian leaders in his church.  At that same time that I wrote that response, a Filipina Friend posted a comment praising Rick Warren's new program. 

It was totally a coincidence that she and I posted within minutes of one another.  But, she got so mad that she unFriended me on Facebook and, to this day, does not speak to me.  Neither she nor her husband will be my Friends on Facebook.  When this happened I wrote her a note telling her that my post was not in response to her - but it was just me sharing my feelings on a situation with which I disagree.  And assured her that I did not even know that she was posting a comment.  She would not hear it.  And to this day will not speak to me. 

Back on track, I believe Warren's "Forty Days of Purpose" program has been very detrimental to the church body.   The first problem I had with it was that churches were encouraged to replace their weekly Bible study with a study of his Forty Days of Purpose book.   In other words, for 40 weeks (almost a year) - what was supposed to be a weekly study of the Bible became a weekly study of Rick Warren's book.  The church groups may have still called it Bible Study, but it was really a Rick Warren Theology Study.

Also in his Purpose Driven book he quotes Gene Peterson's "The Message" (which I view as a commentary at best, and not a Bible) far too much - when he should have been quoting Scripture from the Bible.

I left two different Bible study groups when they started Rick Warren's 40-week program.   And I posted my dislike for that program in my Friends Ministry eNewsletter.   On the East Coast, I believe in North Carolina, there was a group set up (can't say for sure that Rick Warren set it up) whose sole purpose in life was to travel around the country teaching churches how to set up Forty Days of Purpose programs in their churches.

I know of at least one church in Arkansas which split over that being brought into their church.  And according to the report I read at that time - the man in charge of this Forty Days of Purpose program advised the church leader to just let them leave, for they are only trouble makers.  I can't say specifically, but I believe that also happened in other churches.

When I wrote my eNewsletter speaking out against this program - the man in charge of the Forty Days of Purpose seminars sent me an e-mail threatening to sue me if I did not stop writing against their program.  I did not stop, and never heard from him again.

So, to summarize:   Kenneth Copeland?  Stay as far away as possible.   Rick Warren?  I have been to Saddleback Church several times.  But even if I still lived in Orange County I would NOT be a member there.

My Friend, Paul, asked for the short version.  Believe it or not -- this IS my short version!   Now you can see why when I speak at church, after a few minutes my coach, Dory, is always giving me the "finger across the throat" signal to shut up and sit down.  I have no idea why she thinks I talk too much.

God bless, Bill

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Response To "Letter To The Editor" - TimesDaily Newspaper

IN A LETTER TO THE EDITOR of my Alabama hometown newspaper, the TimesDaily, a young Christian lady posted claims against we Conservative Christians which I felt obligated to refute.  I will remove her name to protect her privacy, but will respond to each claim:

Hi Hometown Friend,

Let me reply to your claims in your Letter To The Editor titled "Conservative Christians Are A Contradiction" posted on Mar 20, 2020.  First let me say that I have been a Conservative Christian, a born-again believer since 1987, 33 years.  I am also a Conservative Republican.  I was born and raised in Sheffield, Alabama, and was a registered Democrat until 1964 when the Democratic Party nominated Lyndon Johnson for president.  I went out that day and re-registered Republican.

You say:  Republican ads seem to espouse being: Conservative Christians, pledged supporters of President Trump (proven liar of 16,000 lies, had affairs outside of marriages, belittles people, uses profanity and lacks self-esteem), supporters of the Second Amendment, and tough on crime.

Rebuttal:  Yes, I believe that many Republicans are Conservative Christians (that is a plus).  We pledge support of President Trump because every single campaign promise he made, he has kept - unlike most politicians and especially Democrats. 

You claim, in typical Democrat "Throw IT Against The Wall And See If It Sticks" style of debate - to have proven 16,000 lies told by President Trump.  I would love to see your proof of that claim. 

You say President Trump has had affairs outside of marriage.  Once again, I would like to see proof of that claim.  You say he belittles people and uses profanity.  I have seen him defend himself on Social Media, I believe you would do the same. 

You say he uses profanity.  Personally I have never heard him utter a profane word, but if he did - have YOU ever used a curse word, or used the common slang "OMG"?  Then you are also guilty of profanity.  You say he lacks self-esteem.  Such a claim is like a Democrat standing in a rain storm and asking, "What rain?"  I doubt he became a billionaire by having low self-esteem.

Now let's address your claim of "The Conservative Christian believes (seems to believe)" one by one:

But first let me clarify the difference between a Conservative Christian and a Liberal Christian.  A Conservative Christian views the Bible as the inspired, inerrant, infallible, authoritative, literal Written Word of God.  A Liberal Christian views the Bible as a book of metaphors, symbolism, and myths, i.e., a good guideline for living - but not the literal Written Word of God.

Now to respond to your talking points:

You say we believe:  1) Christ loves a certain ethnicity.

Conservative Christians believe what we read in Romans 10:12, "For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him."

You say we believe:  2) God didn’t create mankind; therefore, they have no inalienable rights, such as voting in all elections, having access to medical care, etc.

Conservative Christians believe what we read in Genesis 1:27, "So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them."

You say we believe:  3) God does not love regardless of creed or color; ergo, that idea is null and void.

Conservative Christians believe what we read in Romans 10:12, "For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him."

You say we believe:  4) Build a wall because the poor, tired, and hungry should not be cared for.

Conservative Christians believe what we read in Matthew 25:35-36, 40, "For I was hungry and you gave Me food; I was thirsty and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger and you took Me in; I was naked and you clothed Me; I was sick and you visited Me; I was in prison and you came to Me. .  .  . And the King will answer and say to them, 'Assuredly, I say to you, inasmuch as you did it to one of the least of these My brethren, you did it to Me.' "

You say we believe:  5) This country does not belong to God, but to certain people.

Conservative Christians believe what we read in Matthew 22:36-40, "'Teacher, which is the great commandment in the law?'  Jesus said to him, 'You shall love the LORD your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind. This is the first and great commandment.  And the second is like it: 'You shall love your neighbor as yourself.  On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets.' "

You say we believe:  6) Exaggerate or use hyperbole just to prove a lie.

Conservative Christians believe this false claim comes straight out of the Liberal Left Democratic Playbook, i.e., make a claim so outrageous, throw IT against the wall - and hope that some people will believe it.  This is what I would expect from anyone who will support Doug Jones.

You say - "I pray that my assessment is wrong."

Conservative Christians say - "Your prayer has been answered - you are wrong!"

You say -  Gov. Kay Ivey, a Conservative Christian, refused to stay the execution of Nathaniel Woods.  Woods was convicted of being with Kerry Spencer, who confessed to killing three policemen, not Woods.  Two jurors, Martin Luther King III, lawyers and celebrities pleaded for leniency for Woods.  Woods was executed by lethal injection on March 5. Ivey declared that “every life is sacred and a gift from God.”  This statement is puzzling, since the governor has consented to end the life of nine men by lethal injection. Her words and actions are a contradiction.

Conservative Christians say - How should a Christian view the death penalty?  First, we must remember that God has instituted capital punishment in His Word; therefore, it would be presumptuous of us to think that we could institute a higher standard. God has the highest standard of any being; He is perfect. This standard applies not only to us but to Himself. Therefore, He loves to an infinite degree, and He has mercy to an infinite degree. We also see that He has wrath to an infinite degree, and it is all maintained in a perfect balance.

Second, we must recognize that God has given government the authority to determine when capital punishment is due (Genesis 9:6; Romans 13:1-7). It is unbiblical to claim that God opposes the death penalty in all instances.  Christians should never rejoice when the death penalty is employed, but at the same time, Christians should not fight against the government’s right to execute the perpetrators of the most evil of crimes.  (from GotQuestions (dot) Org)

Finally You say - I pray to remain a follower of Jesus Christ and never become a Conservative Christian, who contradicts everything that Jesus Christ espoused!

Conservative Christians say - You are showing your Biblical Illiteracy with such a Biblically unsupported claim.  Over the past three years we have seen many Liberal Democrats mouth the words, "I am a Christian believer" - but their actions totally disprove that claim.

My Friend, I truly believe you are a Christian sister, but unfortunately one who has been led down the Liberal Yellow Brick Road.  However, in the last days we will stand as Christian brethren and face our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, side by side. 

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill

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Is This A Health Pandemic - OR - A Political Pandemic?

Is This A Health Pandemic - OR - A Political Pandemic?

I suggest it is a Political Scam Pandemic.   Obama was in office for 8 years, Clintons before him - and the American economy was flat, often declining during those years.  President Trump came into office in 2016 and the American economy became the strongest it has been in the last 40 years.  He did that in less than 3 years whereas the Obamas and Clinton could not do it in their combined 16 years in office.

With the American economy so strong, with America's newfound respect in the world community - the Democrats know they cannot beat Trump in this economic environment.   What is the Democratic Party's solution?  Simple:  Crash the American economy before the 2020 Elections.  That is their only possible chance, if any, of winning the White House.

How can they accomplish that monstrous feat?   Simple.  Cause a worldwide panic: Cause all of America to go into panic mode - Closing companies, Closing schools, Cancelling all sporting and concert events, Stopping or greatly limiting worldwide travel, Stop all imports of needed goods into America by closing our ports, etc.  

All of these things will cause companies to close or greatly limit their business for an indeterminate period - causing people to be laid off, losing their income.  When folks lose their income, they cannot pay their mortgages and rents because they are out of work, they cannot buy needed supplies - causing companies to lose sales.  This causes more lay-offs and more economic shortages - causing the stock market to drop drastically.  The American Economy goes into the tank - making President Trump look bad.  At least in the eyes of the Democrats.

In other words, the Democrats are willing to destroy the American economy - in an attempt to blacken President Trump.  Hoping that will allow them to win the 2020 Election.  Yes, the Democrats, fueled by George Soros and the United Nations - are willing to destroy America just to stop Donald Trump's success.

The Democrats would sell their own souls, or their mothers' souls, in hell - just to win the Election.  Do YOU really want those kind of people in power in Washington DC?

Let's look at the cold, hard facts about the CoronaVirus - VS - the normal year-to-year Flu:

THE COVID-19 CORONAVIRUS OUTBREAK - Last updated: March 13, 2020
https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

Total Deaths to date in USA:    41 
Total Deaths Worldwide to date:    4,983  

DEATHS IN AMERICA ALONE FROM THE FLU BY YEAR:
Centers for Disease Control and Prevention,
National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases (NCIRD)
Report last reviewed: January 10, 2020
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/index.html

YEAR:            TOTAL DEATHS:

2010-2011          37,000 died from the Flu.

2011-2012          12,000 died from the Flu. 

2012-2013          43,000 died from the Flu.  

2013-2014          38,000 died from the Flu.  

2014-2015          51,000 died from the Flu. 

2015-2016          23,000 died from the Flu. 

2016-2017          38,000 died from the Flu. 

2017-2018*         61,000 died from the Flu.  

2018-2019*         34,157 died from the Flu.

Folks, compare those cold, hard figures:  In the last ten years, the smallest number of deaths in America from the Flu was 12,000 in 2011.  The greatest number of deaths in America from the Flu  was 61,000 in 2018.

The deaths in America from CoronaVirus to date is 41.  The deaths worldwide from the CoronaVirus is 4,983.  Compare that to the Flu killing 12,000 to 61,000 in America alone in one year.  Where is the panic?  It is a panic birthed in the combined Democratic Party / George Soros / United Nations backroom politics - and nurtured by the Liberal News Media.  Why?  For one purpose:  Their attempt to win the White House and weaken America.   All other things, including all Americans and their families, be damned as far as they are concerned.  The important thing to that Liberal Left Mob is the 2020 Vote.

I would urge you to do one more thing.  Take a few minutes and watch this video from Dennis Prager and PragerU.  He explains very well what is happening in America and around the world today.

Fireside Chat Episode 125 — Coronavirus: Panic or Pandemic? - Dennis Prager
https://www.facebook.com/prageru/videos/660802021421658/

Then Vote in 2020:

VOTE CONSERVATIVE IN 2020, in all elections: local, state, federal.

VOTE CONSERVATIVE IN 2020, for all candidates and on all issues.

VOTE CONSERVATIVE IN 2020, to leave a Positive Moral Legacy for your children and grandchildren.

BY THE WAY, Voting Conservative in 2020 means VOTING FOR TRUMP IN 2020!

God bless America,

Bill 

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A Moment Of Deja Vu!

Tonight Dory, Lana, and I were talking about the current health problem and how it is connected with China.  And for some reason that triggered a moment of deja vu for me.  When my mom was still alive, Dory and I used to drive to Alabama to spend Christmas and New Years with her and my family.  On our last trip we really hit a lot of bad weather - snow from Flagstaff, Arizona, to Amarillo, Texas - thick ice on the roads from Amarillo all across Oklahoma to the Arkansas border - and heavy rain from there through Memphis before getting good driving weather as we entered Alabama.

When we left Orange County, California, the weather was good and I thought we would make it home to Alabama in no more that five days.  Instead, for several days, due to snow and ice, we could only drive about 15 mph the whole day.  So by Christmas day when I expected to be in Alabama - we were somewhere on Route 40 between Amarillo and Oklahoma City.  At 5:00 PM, with one inch of ice on the highway, I decided to stop for the evening in a small town named Clinton, Oklahoma.

While we were driving Dory had told me that her real estate office in Orange County, Dory Gray Investments, had sold a Holiday Inn in a small town in Oklahoma - but she could not remember the name of the town.

So about 5:00 PM, as it was getting to be dusk, I pulled off the freeway in Clinton, Oklahoma, hoping to find a decent motel and a place to eat dinner on Christmas day.  We found a motel, but their coffee shop was closed on Christmas day.  The manager told us that there was a hotel just down the road, the Park Hotel, which was still serving dinner.   Off we go in search of the Park Hotel.  When we found it, I commented that it looked like a Holiday Inn - but it was the Park Hotel.  Probably just similar architecture.  It still did not ring a bell for Dory or me.

And sure enough their restaurant was open.  Besides Dory and me, there was only one other customer - so the owner, a Chinese gentleman, came over to chat with us.  He introduced himself and asked where we lived.  Dory told him, "Orange County, California."   The man was excited, "My wife and I are from Orange County."  Dory shook his hand and said, "I am Dory Gray and this is my husband, Bill." 

"From Dory Gray Investments?" the man asked excitedly.   "Yes," Dory told him, "that is my real estate company." 

"We bought our hotel through your office," he happily declared.

Then he really got excited and turned to call his wife, "Honey, this is Dory Gray!" 

Wow, I felt like I was traveling with a celebrity.

Imagine the odds of that happening.  To be forced off the freeway in a very small town in the middle of Oklahoma - and to stumble upon this hotel which Dory's office had sold.   Personally I choose to think that was God's way of cheering us up - when, instead of being home in Alabama with family for Christmas - we were stuck in the middle of nowhere on Christmas day.   We did not make it home for Christmas, but we had a very pleasant Christmas day dinner and a good conversation with the Chinese couple who owned the hotel.

God bless, have a wonderful, blessed day,

Bill 

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